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jazzrambler - Posted - 02/08/2010: 13:42:32
Yeah, I liked the black ones until I had to sweep a bar to find one, pissing off the help who wanted us to load out and go home. That's why I bought white.
jazzrambler - Posted - 02/10/2010: 05:13:44
Physically a thicker pick potentially increases your speed by the fact that it takes up more space between the strings. That decreases the distance between pick surface and two adjacent strings. Also, the increased stiffness translates to more string movement with less effort.
Oh, and noztnac, if you like Angelo Debarre, you'll love Raphael Fays. I've had the pleasure of seeing, and the honor of jamming with, both.
un5trung - Posted - 02/10/2010: 06:47:33
Jazz, V-Picks features a half-inch pick. I'm sure it would certainly reduce the distance between strings on my guitar, but I wouldn't be able to jam it between the strings of my mandolin!
And I wouldn't try it, either. 3mm is as thick as I've ever gone, and is thick enough for me!
jazzrambler - Posted - 02/11/2010: 05:56:25
Everything in moderation...when I made my excursion into Gypsy Jazz, just like any interest of mine, it was full immersion. I was making my own picks out of old piano keys, broken vintage pickguards, antique buttons, coconuts...the thicker, the better.
Pick choice is personal but there are a few things to look for and judge a pick by:
Comfort- I don't care if it makes every note sound like Excalibur being freed from the stone, it has to feel good in the hand.
Texture on the string- you are looking for a material that enhances the guitar's tone, more like violin bow than hammered dulcimer. That said, you don't want nails on a chalkboard either.
Consistency- tortoise shell needs near daily maintenance. Ivory is worse. Coconut lasts longer than either but when it goes, it blows chunks. It becomes unplayable.
None of those are very good options if you are gigging. Neither is a $35 Blue Chip that you bought the night before and just fell through a sewer grate because you had it in your pocket...Wegens, to me are great for Gypsy Jazz but won't work on my mandolin at all. Oh, and they're pricey, too. Wheat picks have the ability to suck the life out of your tone.
Right now, I'm happiest with the texture of Red Bear, but can't afford to replace them. If they were $10 dollars, I'd probably have bought 10 of them by now, but at $35, I've only bought 2, I lost one and the other snapped in half.
I'm settling for Golden Gate, but I modify the shape and speed bevel them.
What's up with the world that good pick material is so expensive but oil, meat and bullets are so cheap?
noztnac - Posted - 02/11/2010: 06:45:19
Everything in moderation???
My cousin married a guy who decided to smoke crack in moderation. It didn't work out too well.
jazzrambler - Posted - 02/11/2010: 19:50:27
Man, what is the world coming to when classic aphorisms can't be trusted?
un5trung - Posted - 02/11/2010: 20:01:11
quote:
Everything in moderation
. . . 350 million Buddhists can't be wrong . . . Mandatory guitar content: The Buddha might well have used a Wegen 140, if he'd had the option. Right between a Dunlop .77 nylon and a V-pick 3mm. The middle way.
bazzer - Posted - 02/12/2010: 01:03:27
I've been learning to flatpick for 18 months,would i be right in thinking i should ditch my plastic .73 pick and go to something a bit more substantial, i kinda like the sound of those bluechip ones(the td40 or 50) but they would cost alot more then $35 here in the uk.
un5trung - Posted - 02/12/2010: 06:05:35
Bazzer, try Wegen picks made in your neighbor, The Netherlands. They are expensive compared to a bag of a dozen Dunlops, but cheap compared to Red Bears or Blue Chips. Although I haven't tried the Blue Chip (yet -- one is winging itself my way as I write this) just last night I went back and forth between my $20 Red Bear and $4 Wegen 140 and couldn't say that one was better than the other.
robatsu - Posted - 02/12/2010: 11:56:24
For cheap picks, I like the large triangle Clayton Ultem Golds in 1.20. I have some TS picks that are about the same shape/thickness - you can hear a small bit of a difference (even my wife can), but for jamming, practice, these are fine. Don't have to worry about losing them, etc.
The Red Bear picks sound exactly like the TS picks, in my experience.
Using thicker picks for flatpicking seems a lot more popular than it has been in the past. Back in the day, Steve Kaufmann used to insist that it was pretty necessary to play with the .73 picks, etc. I played with those things for years, along with fender medium teardrops, but moved on a long time ago. Every now and then I play around with one of these and think, "ugh, what was I thinking".
You can make anything work. Kaufmann does his speed thing with .73 picks, Doc Watson with fender mediums, so yeah, it is easier out of the gates to pick fast with a thick pick, but I wouldn't base my decision on that - you can get up to speed w/any pick eventually. Probably what is more important is the tone you can get and what you like. If you've been using thin picks, when you first use a thicker one, the guitar can seem dark, muted, almost muddy until your ear (and technique...) adjusts. Conversely, when I shift back to a thin pick, the guitar sounds thin and almost banjo-like.
bazzer - Posted - 02/14/2010: 09:24:09
Ok un5trung... i'll give them a go thanks....
jazzrambler - Posted - 03/07/2010: 06:22:51
I just got some Clayton Ultems off eBay, and I really like them. They are rounded triangles, 1.20mm. I haven't speed bevelled them yet. I may not need to. No one in town carries them. I hadn't ever tried them before.
un5trung - Posted - 03/12/2010: 15:51:56
quote:
I should say I used the Dunlop Tortex 1.14mm pick for about a year. I also like the Jim Dunlop 1.0mm Nylon pick, but have just fallen in love with the Dunlop 1.0mm Big Stubby.
I like some of the expensive picks, Red Bear C Heavy, Blue Chip CT55, but the cheap dark purple Big Stubby really gives those big boys a run for their money. I use the expensive ones at home, but out of the house I tend to take the Dunlops because they're almost as good and cheap to replace. I wish they came in the soft-edge triangle shape that the C and the CT55 come in; the sharp edge triangle of the Big Stubby doesn't fit well in my hand, leaving only the teardrop version.
un5trung - Posted - 03/15/2010: 11:23:55
It's funny that you can't find Big Stubby picks where you are; up here the Guitar Center pretty much only sells Dunlops! They're cheap -- just a few dollars for a bag of them.
I go to Elderly or eBay for other picks. eBay often has good deals on Wegens, but they have a soft sound that many not suit you. Besides Big Stubby the really bright-sounding picks -- IMHO -- are Red Bear and Blue Chip, both largely available at their respective websites.
forksken - Posted - 03/21/2010: 21:37:54
I go for playability and tone compromises, a medium fender has enough give to snap across the strings and a hard enough material to have a good tone.The only thing I dont like about fender mediums is that I will wear them down and break them after a time. in general a denser material givesa better tone and more volume regardless of thikness. A pick with some elasticity will snap off the string instead of the string snapping off the pick.some matierials slide off the strings easier (nylon) I used the dunlop nylons up to 1.mm for many years.As for a pick that costs 35$,? I think I would make my own before I paid that kind of money for a pick.
un5trung - Posted - 03/22/2010: 05:18:41
quote:
As for a pick that costs 35$,? I think I would make my own before I paid that kind of money for a pick.
I hear you - that was my position as well. But then someone over at the Mandolin Cafe put things into perspective for me -- we'll pay thousands of dollars for the instruments, even $50 for a strap, why not $35 for the medium between the instrument and the player? That seemed to make sense to me, and I bought the CT55, the custom pick "designed" by Chris Thile. Man, it's a great pick. That being said, I played both guitar and mandolin yesterday and went back and forth between the Wegen (soft sound) and a Dunlop Big Stubby (bright sound, like the Blue Chip). For me yes, the pick is worth $35, but yes, you can do without is as well.
jazzrambler - Posted - 03/22/2010: 06:39:30
Personally, I doubt that any of the 'boutique', vintage, or endangered picks would've made any difference to me during my early guitar playing. Let's face it, "Brown Eyed Girl" sounds fine without a Wegen or pre-CITES tortoiseshell. Try Gypsy Jazz and you'll be better off with an old coat button than a Dunlop.
I started gravitation toward thick and even thicker picks when I stared really picking. Single note stuff is just better for me with thicker picks. I worked my way through the Dunlop colors starting at yellow and winding up with the purple for years. Once the picks got thick enough for speed bevelling, the thickness nearly doubled. I was dremeling coconut shells. Wow, I just invented a verb.
Dremeling-v. the act of using a Dremel or other hand held rotary multi-tool.
Now I'm backing off a tad (1.20 Ultems this week, I'd like thicker ones) because there's a diminishing return for rhythm playing. Could I hang in a Bluegrass jam with a Fender Medium? Sure, I doubt it would make it through the night. If I had coconut pick I'd be really having to lay back when playing back up.
Personally, I won't use Dunlop Stubbies because they sound and feel too "plasticky" to me. Nylon picks get a fuzzy edge that slows the string down, Tortex above 1.0 mm looses all its brightness. Fenders chip and break. Nothing is perfect. I like thematerial of Golden Gates, but have never been able to find a standard shape or even rounded triangle. I bought 2 Red Bears last year. I lost one at the Florida Folk Fest and the second snapped in half a month later. I can't afford the heartache...If I ever buy another, I'll spring for the key fob.
Bottom line, find a perfect pick...a pick that makes you want to play. Then you'll sound and play better.
bigt82 - Posted - 03/27/2010: 17:13:33
Thinker is better. I had a friend tell me that try to get it as thick as you can because it brings out the real tone of the guitar.
Tim
jameypittman - Posted - 03/28/2010: 12:31:47
I tend to use very dense material for my picks (Clayton Ultems, Tortoiseshell, etc.) and prefer a thickness of about 1.0 - 1.2 mm depending on the pick material, shape and song.
jazzrambler - Posted - 03/30/2010: 06:12:16
Speaking of old coat buttons, Saturday, I found what I hoped was a real tortoise button, $0.25 at the Flea Market. Turned out to be painted horn. The diameter was big enough that I copied the shape of one of my triangle picks and wound up with a great mandolin/guitar pick.
Try making your own, it can't hurt-unless you hit your finger w/your Dremel (voice of experience!) I will tell you that if you want a coconut pick, the shell thins as the coconuts ripen, so the smaller diameter fruit have thicker shells. A machete is the preferred and time honored tool for busting them, hammers bounce off and don't try to hack saw them unless they are in a vice (again, voice of experience.) I rough them into shape on concrete and then dremel and sand with 1000 grit.
I probably make 10 or 12 picks a year, depending on found materials. It's fun, the payoff is having a few different picks to play with. That keeps things fresh and keeps me from becoming reliant on any one brand or style. I often trade or give them away at`jams. Then I just use whatever is in my pocket. Page: 1 2 3
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